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KarlR



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PostSubject: Re: Stones vs Stooges   Wed May 26, 2010 11:31 am

studioguy wrote:
sweet_sixteen wrote:
Stooges: +100,000 pts for originality
Stones: +1,000,000 pts for longevity

I think they are equally influential.
The Stones directly and the Stooges more indirectly, at least that's how I see it.

I like the Stones just fine, but they don't hit me in the same way the Stooges do. As far as I'm concerned, the Stooges are the greatest rock'n'roll band EVER. 'Exile' versus 'Funhouse'? No competition at all.

As for being influential, maybe we need to look at it another way. I hear Chuck Berry all over the Stones, but I'll be damned if the Stooges sound like anyone else who went before them. And their influence on the whole punk thing is a lot more significant as far as the history & development of music goes than any influence the Stones had.
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MJG196

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PostSubject: Re: Stones vs Stooges   Thu May 27, 2010 4:27 am

Iggy admits he took a lot from the Stones (and the VU) in "No Fun" in this interview:

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Rob Gallucci

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PostSubject: Re: Stones vs Stooges   Thu May 27, 2010 11:35 pm

The best Stones, imho, is from the Mick Taylor period. I bought Beggars Banquet, Let It Bleed and Sticky Fingers in the mid 70's and still play them now, but .... for some reason, the 4th Mick T album, Exile On Main Street, kind of passed me by. I only ever had a cassette of it, now long lost, and it never made the same impression on me as the other 3 albums.

It has just been re-released, and masses of people are saying it is their best EVER album (once you give it a few listens to weave it's magic.) So, Stones fans, before I rush out to buy it, what are your views?
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weed_killer

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PostSubject: Re: Stones vs Stooges   Fri May 28, 2010 12:08 am

Rob Gallucci wrote:
So, Stones fans, before I rush out to buy it, what are your views?

I agree with you about Exile. It starts off with a typical (for that period at least) Stones bang, but then it just kinda drags on with the country/gospel/rock songs. My favourite Stones album is Sticky Fingers, and I think their Mick Taylor period is best too. My second favourite would be Hot Rocks, as the Brian Jones period is my second favourite. At times they kind of had a garage rock attitude with them (Get Off Of My Cloud).

For the main topic, I think the Stones were hugely influential in the 60's, and their look and attitude definitely influenced the Stooges, probably more than their music did.
I would have to say though that the Stones are better, simply because they've lasted longer, and put out a better amount of work.
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jdb1982



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PostSubject: Re: Stones vs Stooges   Fri May 28, 2010 1:19 am

I like the Stones but only own some of their output. Brain Jones era is my favorite. The Stooges just struck a chord with me that few bands have.
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jerrythebarman

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PostSubject: Re: Stones vs Stooges   Fri May 28, 2010 1:38 am

You gotta spend some time with those other "country/gospel/rock" songs that make up most of sides 3 and 4 of Exile- I'm talking about Torn and Frayed (okay, that's on Side 2), Casino Boogie, Ventilator Blues, Shine a Light, and especially Let It Loose and Soul Survivor, among others 'cos they take a little longer to sink in but when they do.....

Someone on the Stones board the other day was relating how a friend of his who considers himself quite a Stones fan, having seen them live a few times, looked at his new copy of Exile and said, "I don't know any of these songs". That's it right there; it's an album full of "deep cuts": apart from Tumbling Dice, and Happy, and maybe All Down the Line, you're never gonna hear anything from Exile on Classic Rock radio and that's one of the things I love about it.

Now, if you can, go listen to Let It Loose and tell me that don't move ya !
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homesickjameswilliamson
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PostSubject: Re: Stones vs Stooges   Fri May 28, 2010 3:04 am

jerrythebarman wrote:
You gotta spend some time with those other "country/gospel/rock" songs that make up most of sides 3 and 4 of Exile- I'm talking about Torn and Frayed (okay, that's on Side 2), Casino Boogie, Ventilator Blues, Shine a Light, and especially Let It Loose and Soul Survivor, among others 'cos they take a little longer to sink in but when they do.....

Someone on the Stones board the other day was relating how a friend of his who considers himself quite a Stones fan, having seen them live a few times, looked at his new copy of Exile and said, "I don't know any of these songs". That's it right there; it's an album full of "deep cuts": apart from Tumbling Dice, and Happy, and maybe All Down the Line, you're never gonna hear anything from Exile on Classic Rock radio and that's one of the things I love about it.

Now, if you can, go listen to Let It Loose and tell me that don't move ya !


I agree completely Jerry, but for me, the beauty of Exile is actually that its an album, you have to listen to it all in one sitting, and the songs, i think even richards said, sound pretty good by themselves, but when its all together it makes sense

when you put it on and just sit and listen to it, it feels like you're travelling across america and seeing all the bars and 'union halls' and hearing all the sounds of that country

and i love how, at least on previous versions (the new one sounding almost 'too clean' for exile) it all mixes in, all the band are in and its like the stones just jamming, best part of it was not knowing what jagger was talking about, you can listen to it a thousand times and still pick up something new everytime and it sets up your own idea of whats happening

anyway, its a great album, one of their best, if not their best, the new songs are good, but i think i prefer aladdin story and dancing in the light in their previous muddy, instrumental only, bootleg quality but 'new/old' songs like plundered my soul and following the river are great - best track is title 5 though


HJW
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jerrythebarman

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PostSubject: Re: Stones vs Stooges   Fri May 28, 2010 3:18 am

Absolutely beautifully put there, HJW. Exile is a place, a state of mind........and things may very well have been swallowed, ingested, knocked back, imbibed et. al. at that p(a)lace.
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birchy



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PostSubject: Re: Stones vs Stooges   Fri May 28, 2010 12:22 pm

Exactly,that's what's so great about Exile and Funhouse,they both seem to transport you to the place and time were they were recorded,like no other albums,you tend to listen to them as a whole.
The Stooges, and the Stones in the late 60's and early 70's made the greatest rock'n'roll albums ever, and sadly I don't think they'll ever be bettered.
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Rob Gallucci

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PostSubject: Re: Stones vs Stooges   Sat May 29, 2010 2:12 am

These views echo those that I am hearing and reading elsewhere - i.e. you have to give Exile time to appreciate it fullt, and listen to it as a whole album, rather than a collection of unrelated songs. You talked me into it guys - I am going to revisit Exile and see if it takes it's place alongside the other 3 Mick T era classics.
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TeddyB1018



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PostSubject: Re: Stones vs Stooges   Sat May 29, 2010 11:56 am

Rob, just FYI, Mick Taylor does not play on Beggar's Banquet and only appears on two songs from Let it Bleed. Most every guitar part on those two albums are played by Keith Richards (Dave Mason and Ry Cooder played some exotic instruments -- any guitar parts by Ry didn't make the final mixes). Brian Jones plays slide on No Expectations.
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Nandayo



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PostSubject: Re: Stones vs Stooges   Sat May 29, 2010 7:06 pm

I like Stooges over the Stones, much more raw power..
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Rob Gallucci

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PostSubject: Re: Stones vs Stooges   Sun May 30, 2010 1:53 am

TeddyB1018 wrote:
Rob, just FYI, Mick Taylor does not play on Beggar's Banquet and only appears on two songs from Let it Bleed. Most every guitar part on those two albums are played by Keith Richards (Dave Mason and Ry Cooder played some exotic instruments -- any guitar parts by Ry didn't make the final mixes). Brian Jones plays slide on No Expectations.

I live and learn a little more every day! Thanks for the info. Perhaps I should now refer to them as the "post-Brian" albums, but that would also include everything after Mick T left.
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homesickjameswilliamson
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PostSubject: Re: Stones vs Stooges   Sun May 30, 2010 6:32 pm

i know its going off topic, but i thought this was a great review of exile

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/05/30/sunday/main6532551.shtml

The classic 1972 Rolling Stones album "Exile On Main Street" has just been re-released for the summer. As you might expect, MTV's Bill Flanagan is a Stones fan of long standing ...


The Rolling Stones have been around for 48 years. For the first half of that time, they concentrated on making records, many of which were fantastic. For the second 24 years, the Stones focused their energies on extravagant and gigantic concert tours.

Now, as the 50-year mark approaches, the Stones are finally entering their retrospective phase. This can be very lucrative: The Beatles have been repackaging their legacy for forty years, and a lot of us still get excited every time they open the vaults. The Stones have never done it - they never looked back.

So it's big news for rock fans that the Stones have lately re-mastered, re-released, and added bonus material to one of their greatest albums, "Exile on Main Street." Mick Jagger, the least sentimental of rock stars, has at last dipped his toe into the river of retrospection.

Those of us who swim in that stream couldn't be happier.

In the spring of 1972, the Beatles had broken up, Dylan was in seclusion and Hendrix was dead. The Stones had claimed the mantle of Greatest Rock & Roll Band in the World with three homeruns in a row: "Beggar's Banquet," "Let It Bleed," and "Sticky Fingers."

"Exile on Main Street" was the topper.

Geometry and Chemistry homework went out the window as we sprawled with our heads between the speakers trying to figure out what Jagger was saying.

At first, it sounded cacophonous: Jagger's voice was mixed so far down that it took about ten listens to hear him above the avalanche of guitars, piano, horns and drums.

That was the beauty of "Exile": You had to play it loud just to make out what was going on. It sounded like it had been recorded in a stinky, sweaty basement - which, it turned out, it had.

The words that finally emerged were a tour of the underside of the mythical American south - juke joints, gunmen, smugglers, diamonds, disease and loose women, married to riffs lifted from gospel songs and Robert Johnson records.

It was the first summer of Watergate and the last summer of Vietnam, so there were also lyrics about black radicals, revolutionaries on trial, and million dollar protest movies.

"Exile" captures all the anxiety, tension and sheer psychic overload of a moment when the old culture seemed to be coming apart and no one had any idea what might replace it.

Those of us who were there never got over it. Those who missed it can now hear what all the fuss was about.

I hope this is the start of the third era of the Rolling Stones - bringing up the diamonds from the mine.
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MJG196

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PostSubject: Re: Stones vs Stooges   Mon May 31, 2010 1:13 am

The initial reviews of the remaster (on the Stones forum) are generally excellent. Although a slight bit of compression/loudening is evident, nearly everyone is pleased with the increased clarity. Of the several CD-reissues, this remaster seems to be the best.

homesickjameswilliamson wrote:
i know its going off topic, but i thought this was a great review of exile

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2010/05/30/sunday/main6532551.shtml

The classic 1972 Rolling Stones album "Exile On Main Street" has just been re-released for the summer. As you might expect, MTV's Bill Flanagan is a Stones fan of long standing ...


The Rolling Stones have been around for 48 years. For the first half of that time, they concentrated on making records, many of which were fantastic. For the second 24 years, the Stones focused their energies on extravagant and gigantic concert tours.

Now, as the 50-year mark approaches, the Stones are finally entering their retrospective phase. This can be very lucrative: The Beatles have been repackaging their legacy for forty years, and a lot of us still get excited every time they open the vaults. The Stones have never done it - they never looked back.

So it's big news for rock fans that the Stones have lately re-mastered, re-released, and added bonus material to one of their greatest albums, "Exile on Main Street." Mick Jagger, the least sentimental of rock stars, has at last dipped his toe into the river of retrospection.

Those of us who swim in that stream couldn't be happier.

In the spring of 1972, the Beatles had broken up, Dylan was in seclusion and Hendrix was dead. The Stones had claimed the mantle of Greatest Rock & Roll Band in the World with three homeruns in a row: "Beggar's Banquet," "Let It Bleed," and "Sticky Fingers."

"Exile on Main Street" was the topper.

Geometry and Chemistry homework went out the window as we sprawled with our heads between the speakers trying to figure out what Jagger was saying.

At first, it sounded cacophonous: Jagger's voice was mixed so far down that it took about ten listens to hear him above the avalanche of guitars, piano, horns and drums.

That was the beauty of "Exile": You had to play it loud just to make out what was going on. It sounded like it had been recorded in a stinky, sweaty basement - which, it turned out, it had.

The words that finally emerged were a tour of the underside of the mythical American south - juke joints, gunmen, smugglers, diamonds, disease and loose women, married to riffs lifted from gospel songs and Robert Johnson records.

It was the first summer of Watergate and the last summer of Vietnam, so there were also lyrics about black radicals, revolutionaries on trial, and million dollar protest movies.

"Exile" captures all the anxiety, tension and sheer psychic overload of a moment when the old culture seemed to be coming apart and no one had any idea what might replace it.

Those of us who were there never got over it. Those who missed it can now hear what all the fuss was about.

I hope this is the start of the third era of the Rolling Stones - bringing up the diamonds from the mine.
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homesickjameswilliamson
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PostSubject: Re: Stones vs Stooges   Mon May 31, 2010 1:31 am

Quote :
The initial reviews of the remaster (on the Stones forum) are generally excellent. Although a slight bit of compression/loudening is evident, nearly everyone is pleased with the increased clarity. Of the several CD-reissues, this remaster seems to be the best.

It definitely is better, i was just saying i think i personally prefer pervious versions, i havent done a comparison, but there is an improvement with the new set that gives it extra punch, but i liked the muddy aspect of the old one

but like i said i havent done a comparison, havent even listened to the older CD i had for months if not years, so maybe it is inferior
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MJG196

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PostSubject: Re: Stones vs Stooges   Mon May 31, 2010 1:38 am

homesickjameswilliamson wrote:
Quote :
The initial reviews of the remaster (on the Stones forum) are generally excellent. Although a slight bit of compression/loudening is evident, nearly everyone is pleased with the increased clarity. Of the several CD-reissues, this remaster seems to be the best.

It definitely is better, i was just saying i think i personally prefer pervious versions, i havent done a comparison, but there is an improvement with the new set that gives it extra punch, but i liked the muddy aspect of the old one

but like i said i havent done a comparison, havent even listened to the older CD i had for months if not years, so maybe it is inferior

The bonus tracks are great, too.

You may want to give the vinyl-2-digital transfer a shot that is up on Demonoid. If you need help logging in, shoot me a PM. Here is the lineage of that transfer:

Original Kinney (Canadian) pressing > VPI Scoutmaster w/ Trans-Fi Terminator Air Bearing Linear Tracing Tonearm > Audio-Technica AT33PTG cartridge > Pro-Ject TubeBox phono preamp > E-MU 1212 soundcard

All rips are recorded in full 24bit 192khz resolution and then resampled to 44/24 for manual click repair. They are then dithered to standard redbook 16bit/44khz. IzotopeRX Advanced for all resampling/dithering


That PBthal is a master. Personally, I enjoy the new Exile remaster and really enjoy it, but PREFER the vinyl transfer. Maybe we need a Stones thread...
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homesickjameswilliamson
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PostSubject: Re: Stones vs Stooges   Mon May 31, 2010 2:01 am

The extra tracks are great, i think i prefer ones like dancing in the light and aladdin story as instrumentals, but 'new'/'old' songs like plundered my soul and following the river are excellent, i think plundered my soul is the best out of the 10 - that or title 5, i love that song

I'll check out the vinyl version as well, thanks
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